Episode 67: Sensual Sex Ed (with Goody Howard)

What if you’d been taught about sensuality as a child? How different would your relationship to your body and sex be today? In this one, Ev’Yan speaks to sexologist and comprehensive sex educator, Goody Howard, about the importance of sex education, one that includes sensuality, body literacy, and human variance equity during a time when all of those things are being threatened. They also answer some listener questions about healing sexual shame, practices to help you stay sensual while living in an unsensual world, and how to come out to your partner as asexual.

The full transcript of this episode is below.

Links/mentions:

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Goody Howard, MSW, MPH is an award-winning sexologist, educator, and consultant. She provides pleasure development and professional development workshops worldwide. Her authentic and enthusiastic presentation style allows her audiences to connect quickly to the concepts and enjoy learning about sexual health, pleasure, and human variance equity. She makes pleasure-inclusive, comprehensive sex education accessible, intentional, and fun! While Goody’s pleasure-focused offerings are her most popular classes, she also teaches relevant career development workshops for educators, social workers, and healthcare providers. Join the “Goody Gang” email list and connect with her online at @askgoody on most social media platforms or on her website askgoody.com.


Transcription:

Hey, welcome to Sensual Self. I'm Ev'Yan Whitney and this is a space for you to slow down, tune in, heal and feel the sensations and pleasures of your sensual body. Thank you for being here.

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Why hello folks, I am so excited to dive into another sensual episode with you today. And speaking of sensuality, I'm not sure if you can hear but there are birds tweeting around my windows, there's flowers blooming, a breeze is wafting through my windows. It's spring, and it feels so good to be in springtime and also in Taurus season. I just wanted to share that. It was on my spirit.

Okay, anyway. Today's episode is pretty juicy. Today I'm talking with comprehensive sex educator, sexologist, and I don't think she calls herself this but to me, she is the embodiment of a sensualist, miss Goody Howard. And in this episode, we talk about honestly, everything. This episode is filled with all kinds of goodies, no pun intended, for your listening pleasure. I mean, we talk about everything. Goody's definition of sensuality, and how to access it in an accessible and practical way. We talk about the importance of comprehensive sex education, how it's literally the basis for everything, and how Goody's work educates folks from the cradle to the grave about consent, identity and pleasure. Listen, we got into it. And all of that is not even why I asked Goody to be on today.

I originally wanted to bring Goody on to answer some listener questions about sensuality. But, you know, we got to talkin' and explored all kinds of other things that were very top of mind for both of us. Like all of these whack-ass laws that are being passed in states like Florida, that make it so that teachers are not allowed to talk about sexual orientation or gender identity in schools—which, my condolences if you happen to live in Florida, and also fuck Ron DeSantis. Anyway, we got into a lot, but we somehow still managed to find time to answer some of your questions. We answered questions from folks about sensual practices you can do when you're living in a very unsensual environment, how to come out to your very horny partner as asexual, and how to get rid of sexual shame that is getting in the way of your ability to be in your sensual body. And sidebar, if you have questions about your sensuality, sex, sexuality, pleasure that you'd love to have answered on the show, go to evyanwhitney.com/podcast. I'll put the link in the show notes and fill out the form over there. I would love to hear from you and you know, collaborate and co-create a conversation with you.

This episode is a cornucopia of sensuality and sexual liberation. And I am so thrilled to share it with you. Feel free to take breaks and to take notes. To pause when you need to to savor Goody's brilliance. And please also follow and support her work. You will hear details about how to do that in just a few moments. And yeah, if this is your first time hearing the name Goody Howard, if this is the first time hearing about her work, I am so thrilled to introduce you to her so let's get into it. And I'll be back soon.

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Goody. I'm so excited to have you on my podcast. Thank you for being here.

Goody Howard

Of course. Thank you for having me.

Ev'Yan Whitney

I just have to say your tagline I think on Instagram it is "your favorite sex educator's favorite sex educator", is that right?

Goody Howard

I think I don't know which platform it is, but it's on one of 'em.

Ev'Yan Whitney

Well, I just want to say that that is true. You are my favorite sex educator and I want that to go down in history. Let's like, let's make that official. I love the way you think I love the way you talk. And I've as we were saying, Before we hit record, I've had the privilege of being on many a panel with you and your brilliant mind when it comes to sensuality and relationship dynamics, and creating space for your sensual and sexual self is deeply admirable to me. So I'm just so fucking jazzed to have you on today.

Goody Howard

Aw you gonna make a thug cry out here. Like, I actually put that up joking. You know, I don't know who I was talking to. And they said, like, you know how they say, "oh, that's your favorite rapper's favorite rapper", we were having a hip hop conversation. Because I'm very much that person as well. So we were having like a hip hop conversation. And they like, that's your favorite rapper's favorite rapper. And I said, Ludacris they said rank your top five or whatever. And Ludacris was in my top five. And they were like, what? And I was like, he's underrated as hell.

Ev'Yan Whitney

Yeah, I would agree with that.

Goody Howard

And people started thinking about it they were like, Yo, he's probably your favorite rapper's favorite rapper kind of thing, right? And I was like, I want to be your favorite sex educator's favorite sex educator. That's why- That's how that became a thing. And i put it in my bio, I don't even know which one I put it in.

Ev'Yan Whitney

I think it's on Instagram because I was looking at your profile for something maybe to prepare for this interview today. And I was like, yeah, that tracks. That's accurate. So I thought it was really clever. I mean, it sounds like it wasn't totally, totally, you know, intentional, but I mean, it is with me. So

Goody Howard

That is so dope. Thank you for that. I love hearing that.

Ev'Yan Whitney

Yeah. Tell me how I know who you are. But tell the folks who you are what you do. Yeah, just tell us everything.

Goody Howard

Okay, well, my name is Goody Howard. And that is my legal name. People always ask me, is that your real name? That's my legal name. It's not my born name, but it's my legal name. And I am a sex educator, sexologist, consultant. And I always say I have two business models. I have a pleasure development business model, which is askgoody.com That's where I do the, you know, sexual skill-building workshops, the soft and the hard. So I have the Sensual Intelligence workshop, the Relationships Goals, which is love, anger, and apology language workshop. And then I also have like, you know, dick riding and oral sex on the penis, oral sex on the vulva. And then I have professional development through my other entity, Wish Training Solutions, and that is professional development around sexual health equity and human variance equity for educators, social workers and health care providers. So that looks like the workshops are like sex and aging, sex and disability, sex, gender, and orientation, navigating pronouns, things like that. So those are the ways that I move through the world, I'm a comprehensive sexuality educator, I teach comprehensive sex ed from the cradle to the grave. Shit, I mean... I feel like that's a lot I'm also I'm also a dildo dealer. I sell sex toys. And I have a line of merchandise called Goody Gear, which is sex positive, funny t-shirts and tote bags and things like

Ev'Yan Whitney

Yes, them t-shirts, though.

Goody Howard

Like I have a t-shirt that says “Get on his dick, not on his nerves.” And then I have another one says “Work their clit, not their nerves.”

Ev'Yan Whitney

Yesss!

Goody Howard

Like, I just be randomly thinking of stuff. I've been doing this almost almost 16 years. Um, so of course, I started doing this when I was two. No, I'm playing! [laughs] I been doing this for almost 16 years, full time for six.

Ev'Yan Whitney

Well, thank you for doing what you do. I especially really appreciate the work that you do around comprehensive sex ed for, as you said, cradle to the grave. It is so so important, especially now more than ever, to to make sure that that is a thing that is happening. You know, I mean, I'm seeing as I'm sure you are seeing sort of this war on sex that is going on. And you know, thinking about like the don't say gay bill and all of these things. And so I just I really appreciate—

Goody Howard

I'm really glad that was Florida, not Texas because Texas stays embarrassing me.

Ev'Yan Whitney

Right?

Goody Howard

But Florida, honey, leave it to Florida. Really, really show up and show out. And I think, you know, Oscar Wilde has a quote that says, "Everything in the world is about sex except sex. Sex is about power." And literally, everything can be traced back to the expression, oppression or repression of human sexuality.

Ev'Yan Whitney

That's right.

Goody Howard

And so when I do comprehensive sex ed cradle to the grave It looks like understanding at the pre K level that maybe Johnny has two moms. Maybe Michelle has a mom and two dads or maybe, maybe William’s mom used to be William’s dad. And understanding what that looks like and understanding that families look different, and families are worthy of respect, no matter how they show up, which is human variance equity. Yeah, that to me. So human variance equity is making space to respect humanity in every way that it shows up. I had not heard of that theory before. I think I made it up in my head, I feel like I did. I'm trying to get a trademark now as a concept for framework that we can kind of flesh out. Because I feel like diversity and inclusion is ingenuine—

Ev'Yan Whitney

And it's overused.

Goody Howard

It's overused and it feels like—okay, mainstream, those are the others. This is what you need to know about the others. And this is how we tolerate the others in our mainstream spaces. Others, welcome to the mainstream. So it feels more assimilative and more ethnocentric than cultural relativist, right. So when you come into a space, telling people what they need, instead of asking them what they need, you're not making space for that human variance equity piece. And so when I go into a space, even at pre K, that's what human variance equity looks like. People are like, Oh, they're children. We trust kids to know that they're straight. We trust kids to know that they're cisgender. We don't trust them to know that they're not.

Ev'Yan Whitney

Yes.

Goody Howard

And why is that? You know what I'm saying? And so it looks like that you if you start teaching kids about the variances of humanity, as they grow older and become exposed in their lived experience to more variance, they are not going to it's not going to be as taboo, it's not going to be as odd. It's not going to be as polarizing. It's just going to be a Tuesday.

Ev'Yan Whitney

Yes, that's right. Ah, see, this is why I appreciate the work that you do. Because, yes, you are shilling out, you know, dildos and these fun little t-shirts that you know, I have too, I'm also surprised that you haven't gotten any. I see your t-shirts, and I'm like, wow, McDonald's signed off on that? But yes, you do that part of that work, which I think is fun and goofy and playful. But there's this. I think sometimes folks forget that sex education isn't just about dildos. Yes, yes. It's an it's, it's, I love what you're talking about to about. You call it human variance equity. Like that makes so much sense in my brain and I when I think about sex education, that to meet like, that's, to me is like the foundation of us being able to see each other, respect each other, see each other as like, autonomous people with agency and things like that, like it really starts at at sex education to me, so I'm just so grateful that you do the work that you do, and you do it with so much like style and simplicity. And like, it's by simplicity, I just mean that it's, it's just, like, easy to express and it's accessible.

Goody Howard

I feel like if it's not accessible, it's not revolutionary, and I consider myself a revolutionary. And I feel like I have been blessed. The universe has definitely given me a set of skills to be able to take higher, more, you know, overarching concepts and frameworks, and kind of funnel them down into bite-sized pieces that laypeople can grasp easily. And I think that is what sexuality education is missing. Because when they hear sex, they stopped listening. You know what I'm saying? So because people feel like have this *gasp* to it, when I reframe stuff, and take sexuality out and replace sex with pleasure. They hear it differently.

Ev'Yan Whitney

Yeah

Goody Howard

It's not porn, we're not worried about the children. And when we're looking at sexual health and pleasure on a social whole, pleasure is included in that because sexual pleasure is sexual health, and sexual health is public health. If it's all included, and I'm gonna get you come in and go, and I'm gonna get you as an educator, as a social worker, as a health care provider, or as a person receiving services from the people that have taken my workshops, you're gonna get handled differently. I'm picking up the health side, and I'm also picking up the pleasure side because when the attitudes shift around access to pleasure, the way you choose your romantic relationships is going to look different too.

Ev'Yan Whitney

That's right.

Goody Howard

And when you choose different romantic relationships, you directly impact the negative health outcomes around STIs, unwanted pregnancy, intimate partner violence. Because your relationship satisfaction has grown, because you had a better understanding of your pleasure and how to communicate that. Right? So I'm a root-cause kind of bitch. You know what I'm saying.? So that's how I try to keep them coming and going with pleasure and health, you know. And I- There's a there's a story for helping professionals. It's called the starfish story. Are you familiar with it?

Ev'Yan Whitney

I'm not, no.

Goody Howard

Okay. So there's this, there's this, this beach. And every year on this beach, all these starfish wash up on this beach, and they die, they just dry out and die every year. So this person comes down, and they picking up starfish and throwing them in the ocean. They're picking them up and just throwing them back so they don't die, right? Someone else comes by and says, "Hey, what are you doing? They'll be back next year, what are you doing? It doesn't matter. It doesn't matter." And the person picking up the fish says, “It matters to this one”, and throws it back in. “It matters to this one”, and throws it back in. So helping professionals are the people on the beach, throwing back in. That's what therapists do. One at a time, micro-practice. It matters to this one, it matters to this one. I am not a therapist, because I'm an empath. And I don't have the capacity. So I'm a macro-practice. So I'm creating workshops and programs because I'm going to the beach and I'm going, “They come back every year. So why are they coming back every year? Are they washing up on accident? Looking for food? Do we need to chum the water? Do we need to build a reef out here? Are they coming up here by accident? Is there something that you know resonates with their pheromones, they kind of lay eggs and die? Like, what do they come up here to do? Is that part of their starfish lifecycle, and we interrupting their shit by throwing them back in the water? Or is this a mistake and we need to correct it so that you know maybe, you know impacts something else in the ocean, you know, kind of ecosystems kind of thing, right?” I'm the bitch that's like that. I'm wondering, okay, why are they coming? What can we do to keep them from coming in the first place? The starfish story is for all of us. That's what we're all doing in some way, shape, or form those of us that are trying to leave the world better than we found it.

Ev'Yan Whitney

That's right. That's right.

Goody Howard

You know, so I always tell that story for people like helping professionals like that do what we do. And similar because we are shifting the social structures, hopefully, prayerfully.

Ev'Yan Whitney

Yeah, well, thank you, thank you for the work that you do. And I'm so excited to have you on today to talk about sensuality. Your definition of sensuality is like, one of my favorites that I think I've ever heard. Talking, like going back to what you were saying about how you like to make things accessible, you know, and like, bring it down, like distill it down to a point that people can really understand and grasp it. So I would love for you to tell us your definition of sensuality. And then you know, we can talk a little bit about some of these questions that people have asked us about sex and love and relationships and identity. But first, what is sensuality to you, Goody Howard?

Goody Howard

Sensuality to me means experiencing nonsexual pleasure through all six of the senses. Sight, sound, taste, touch, scent, and feel. When you move to the world more sensually, you experience the world differently. So when it's time to get sexual, you're experiencing sex through all six of the senses, right? So it's a very much layered pleasure. It's a very intentional pleasure. And it makes you more receptive to the over 18 different kinds of orgasms that the human body has to offer. And so I think we conflate you know, sensuality and sexuality. But I very much drew out my working definition because I don't think people really understand. They always associate sensuality with some sort of sexual luxury or pleasure.

Ev'Yan Whitney

Yes, that's one of the reasons why love your definition. Because in the work that I have done around sensuality, I come up against that a lot. Like a lot of people use sensuality, interchangeably with sex and sexuality. And I feel like it's such a big, it's such a big task to like, undo that. It's not programming but just to to redefine what sensuality is for those people.

Goody Howard

You have to rewrite that code.

Ev'Yan Whitney

Yeah

Goody Howard

Like one of the things that I have started doing on my social media, every time I think of a sensual moment, if I think of sensuality, in action in a non sexual way, right? I make a little video, reminding people that this is sensuality in motion. Like I did one of getting a pedicure. I did one where I was just all you saw was my hands on the video and I was peeling an orange. And I was talking, it was my voice over talking about how peeling an orange is a sensual activity, and just talking about how it engages all the senses and it's a pleasurable experience. And honestly, every time I eat an orange, I'm like, why don't want eat oranges more often? That was really, that was really good. Why don't I do eat them more, but like, it's a non sexual pleasure. And so I'm really starting to document non sexual pleasure, I think you do a really good job of that too, on your socials with like, even because when people think about sensuality, and pleasure, it's still pleasure. I love how you draw the line in the sand around things that even are not necessarily pleasurable, or things that are impeding your pleasure, like how you're spending your free time, what are you thinking about? How are you holding your body? I think you're doing a really good job of highlighting the expansion of what pleasure can be, because pleasure is the good can be described as the absence or presence of joy, right? And so that, like you have to discuss pleasure and the impediments to pleasure and so, especially with that reprogramming piece, we don't even realize how we miss align ourselves when it comes to simple non sexual pleasure, because we start off at a deficit. You wake up checking your phone, you have a television in your room, you know, you have your your your light bulbs are harsh.

Ev'Yan Whitney

Mm hmm. Yes, that's right. Or like your environment in your home isn't conducive to the sensual life that you want to live. Like, maybe there's art on the walls that don't give you joy anymore. Or maybe you're like, I hate that the walls are white, like they should be a fun color. Like there's so many different layers to sensuality that I think have been flattened by this definition that it's only sexual. You know, I say this a lot in in podcasts and in talks. But I want to say it again, that one of the best ways to understand the way that our world culture thinks about what sensuality is, is by doing a Google image search and just typing in the word sensual, or sensuality, and seeing the images will give you a very vivid understanding of what sensuality is. And I'll tell you right now that it is white women who are thin, long blonde hair, blue eyes, wearing lingerie, sucking lollipops, contorting their bodies in ways that are, you know, meant to entice and incite the male gaze. Now, there's nothing wrong with that, like I believe that sensuality can live in those things. But this idea that sensuality is only that, like

Goody Howard

Right, like it can't exist in any other kind of way,

Ev'Yan Whitney

Right. And that and also too thinking about folks like you and me, don't look like that, you know, like, you and me don't have long blonde hair with blue eyes. And you know, like, That's not who we are. And so I love I love folks like you who is helping to do this workaround sensuality to make it accessible, because that accessibility piece is so important. Like I always say to people, if you have a body, your a sensual being like full stop. It doesn't matter what you look like, it doesn't matter what abilities you have, like you are a sensual being and-

Goody Howard

We are sensual beings having earthly experiences.

Ev'Yan Whitney

That's right. That's right. And if we start there, that is that, to me is liberation. You know, like, especially coming from that, that this programming, that sensuality is about sucking a lollipop while looking at the camera like and like this is kind of a perfect segue to get into some listener questions. I was asking some folks on Instagram, if they had any questions regarding sex, sensuality, sensual living, bodies, whatever. And we would answer it on the show. We got a lot of questions. And in the interest of time, I don't know if we'll get to all of them. But if you're down, I can read you some of them and we can we can see if we can help some of these people.

Goody Howard

Okay, I'm here for it.

Ev'Yan Whitney

All right. All right. So our first question starts with how can I lean into sensuality when I'm in a place that is not supportive of that? So things like foul air, cold weather, dog shit in the street, someone else's mess that isn't getting cleaned up in my personal space? Normally, I'm a forest slash mountain person, but I feel like I'm suffocating and I've lost my sensuality. What do you have to say to this person? We were kind of talking about that a little bit like about how like bringing up the impediments to sensuality? So yeah, I'm curious. I'm curious what you have to save to this person.

Goody Howard

Wow. There's so much there and you're like sensuality starts at home like charity starts at home?

Ev'Yan Whitney

Yeah, that's right.

Goody Howard

Like when they're talking about the impediments to pleasure in their personal space and people not cleaning up after themselves and things like that, I would say, I honestly say a shadow shower, if I'm being completely honest, I would say you know, clean your bathroom and get your bathroom to a space that you're comfortable with it. In this regard, if there is like an issue with like the smell of the room, or what have you cleaning, it will help with the smell. But a shadow shower is when you get in the bathroom, and you take a shower in the complete dark, no, no candles, no music, no lights, no sounds no nothing. And so you're in the shower, because you know where everything is on your body. And you know where everything is in your bathroom, or in your, you know, your your immediate tub, shower area, you know, your eyes will adjust, right, but you start to just pay attention to how your senses are engaged in the shower, right, sight. You can't see but then you kind of can. So you're being more mindful of the way you're using your eyes to see things. Scent. That could be the soap, you're using the little shower biscuit thing. Any of those types of things, even the water may have a scent, you know how you can smell rain coming and things like that.

Ev'Yan Whitney

Yeah.

Goody Howard

Sound, the sound of the water, the sound of your breathing. The way the water changes, like if you have a washcloth or a body puff and you squeeze it out like the water, that immediate water versus the shower water, like just the sounds are just very, very integral in that because you're listening to your breathing in the water, just feel cleansing and cathartic to me. So listening to that is something that is meditative. And then you have the taste, which you can kind of taste the air, you can put the water in your mouth and like swish it around and spit it out. You know, things like that. And then you have touch which is the water on the skin, the soap on the skin, the washcloth, the body puff, even touching your skin to see if there's more soap left, or if that part needs to be cleaned again, like all of those different things that kind of engage the sense of touch, and then the sense of feel, how are you feeling in that moment. Sometimes it's been a very long day, a very hard day, a very joyous day, whatever the case may be. If you need to cry, that's the perfect time to do so. Because the tears blend with the shower, and it just all washes down the drain. So you get out of that shower, feeling cleansed from several different perspectives. And so what what the shadow shower does, is it makes you hyper aware of yourself. And so it's kind of like a recentering activity, to then make you more intentional with how you pay attention to the way your senses are engaged outside of that space.

Ev'Yan Whitney

Yes.

Goody Howard

But yeah, and I think paying attention to your impediments to pleasure. But this person is specifically paying attention to your impact to the impediments of your pleasure, and figuring out a whose responsibility it is to remove those impediments. Because sometimes we feel like it's ours. And sometimes it's not our stuff. Right, so figure out whose responsibility it is to manage those impediments, a call to action for them to manage that shit. Okay, and possibly setting forth a boundary or an expectation around future causes of impediment. So if it's you, if your room is a mess, and it's causing you an issue, and you don't, you're not cleaning your room, because you don't have enough time, then that call to action is gonna be managing your time different. Setting aside some time to clean your room. Because there's no worse feeling to be mad at yourself. You know? Well, hopefully that's helpful. Hopefully, that's helpful.

Ev'Yan Whitney

Yeah, no, I love your answer. Because I was going to add that, like, it's so important to make sure that you are carving out space and time for you to be within your own sensual body on your own sensual terms. And when I was reading this, this question, I couldn't help but thinking about, you know, people who live in cities. And cities, I live in Los Angeles, I used to live in a pretty like, quiet area in Portland, Oregon. And while I love being here, it is very loud. There are all kinds of things that are assaulting my senses, from leaf blowers to helicopters to dogs barking in the distance. I'm not very close to nature. You know, there's a lot of concrete around me, there's a lot of dogs walking, like when this person is talked about dog shit I was like, that's real. I see that shit all the time. So I was going to add to that, like in terms of what you said about, you know, creating these spaces. The reason why creating those spaces for for being into your sensual self is to sort of ground you back into the pleasure that you can experience. Because I know for me, as a helicopter goes by, sometimes that's like the only thing I'm feeling at the time or hearing or experiencing. And the truth is that that's not all that there is, you know? And sometimes you might have to be like, okay, yes, there is a helicopter buzzing around and it is so obnoxious. But in this moment, I love the way that my, my my body is feeling as I'm resting in the chair, you know. Like seeing if you can- I think sometimes sensuality and pleasure can be looked at as being very black or white. Like it's either it feels good, or it doesn't like you have to be in one space or the other. And I'm really interested, even though it's very difficult to do, it takes practice, like, what does it look like for you to experience the both and like, we live in a very unsensual world. But we can also access sensuality and pleasure at any time. So maybe that looks like you're walking and you see dog shit on on the floor. And you're like, Okay, I acknowledge the dog shit. And I'm going to turn my eyes over to these beautiful purple flowers that I'm also walking by instead, I think that that can be a really good practice, as well as I love your shadow shower recommendation, because I think that is also just a really beautiful way to ground back into your body.

Goody Howard

Yeah, and you don't have to make time to set aside time for your pleasure and your, your sensuality. You got to wash your ass anyway.

Ev'Yan Whitney

That's right. That's right.

Goody Howard

I'd like to think that we are at least washing our ass a few times a week. So.. I mean, you ain't gotta wash your ass every day studies show that you don't have to. But I mean, you know, once or twice a week. Yeah, in those times, practice, you know, utilize that sensual practice.

Ev'Yan Whitney

Yes, yes. Okay. Great. Love that. I hope that was helpful. Another question we have is also about sensuality, how can I be in my sensual self during a time of transition? And it seems as though this person is experiencing some, some hardship through this transition. And they're feeling like it's very scary and hard to be in their body right now.

Goody Howard

I am going to- I don't like to assume. So when we're saying transition, because i Because, you know, I'm trained, I'm trained to do therapy.

Ev'Yan Whitney

Yeah.

Goody Howard

To me transitions do not solely rest in gender.

Ev'Yan Whitney

That's right. Yes.

Goody Howard

So is this person saying that they are living, you know, living through their transition? You know, gender confirmation ways?

Ev'Yan Whitney

That is a good question. They didn't specify.

Goody Howard

You know, maybe you moved to a new city, or someone has just passed away, or you have a new job, or you know, what I'm saying like life transitions look so different. I'm going to go on a limb and maybe speak from the perspective of gender confirmation transition.

Ev'Yan Whitney

Yeah, that's great.

Goody Howard

Because that I feel like is a unique time and human beings body.

Ev'Yan Whitney

Yes, yes.

Goody Howard

And while I can't, you know, fathom the weight of the joy and ambiguity and angst, anxiety that comes with that. I think that keeping the bigger picture in mind when you especially when you feel super disconnected from yourself, understanding that, you know, there's a cocoon butterfly kind of situation happening. And, like you said, the simultaneous redirects of the simultaneous both impediment and pleasure. I think a shadow shower specifically could help and support people specifically with gender dysphoria, or people that are filling in, maybe incongruence in their bodies in the phase of transition that they're in, because it's dark.

Ev'Yan Whitney

Yeah.

Goody Howard

And you are coming in contact with your skin and your neck, and your ears and your face and your back, and your chest and your tummy. And all of these body parts individually don't have a gender. Body parts don't have a gender, gender is a social construct. So maybe at that point, instead of saying, Okay, I'm gonna use myself as an example. Instead of saying, you know, this is Goody, this is, you know, of your saying, you know, this is something that reminds you of your pre confirmation journey, right, your pre pre confirmation existence. And then there may be other parts of your body that are exemplary of your, the process of the transition, right? Focus more on just the you, the personhood, not the gender identity, not the sexuality, not the orientation, the human being. Because human being does not have a gender identity, and you are no less worthy of sensual joy. Because you're transitioning. If anything, you're on a path to the most sensual joy you've ever experienced, because that sense of feel is going to be in such alignment with your spirit. That's going to be something that's uncontainable. You know, and so I think just concentrating on the humanity of who you are. And taking care of your skin, taking care of your hair, whatever that looks like, be it growing it out, be it shaving it off. Like, take care of the pieces of you. Until the whole picture of you looks like something that resonates with you.

Ev'Yan Whitney

I love that Goody, I love that. I love that you answer that question in that way. And I too don't know if this is if this person is speaking specifically about like, gender transition, or just like a life transition that they're going through.

Goody Howard

I think it's applicable either way.

Ev'Yan Whitney

Yeah, that's right.

Goody Howard

You know, because like, as a person that's grieving. I'm a daddy's girl and my dad has been, has passed away almost a little over a year now. No, I'm a little over two years now. And I and still some I'm outside of my own body sometimes. And I don't feel like myself. And I only recognize pieces of me. So I just take care of the pieces that I recognize. And maybe I get to know the pieces that I don't. Because there is no new normal there is a before and there is an after. So when you're in the midst of that, when you're in the space between before and after, you may not recognize yourself, but that doesn't mean that you have any less of an obligation and responsibility to take care of yourself.

Yeah, yeah.

Because no one else is gonna do it, you have to take care of you. You can't pour from an empty cup. So take care of the pieces that you recognize, get to know the pieces that you don't, until the picture comes together and you feel like you.

Ev'Yan Whitney

Wow, I love that I don't have anything to add. And I will say that as a nonbinary person who has been dealing with some serious gender dysphoria over the last couple of weeks, I needed to hear what you said. So thank you. Thank you for that. Okay, a couple more questions. Do you have any advice for coming out to your very horny partner, as someone on the ace spectrum? I have so many thoughts about this.

Goody Howard

I think there needs to be some documentary, some sort of media, like you need to play him a movie, I don't know. Because ace is something that most people don't understand. I don't think a horny person, a super sexual person is going to. They're going to feel like it's them. They're gonna make it about them. And so honestly, I don't know, I really feel like an ace person, or someone that has more experience in that would be someone that would be more equipped to answer that in a helpful way. You know, some people just say shit, and it's super unhelpful.

Ev'Yan Whitney

Yeah, yeah.

Goody Howard

I don't want to be unhelpful. Because I'm thinking like, show them a documentary about asexuality. And then have a conversation about what that looks like. And then, and then introduce how that is a part of who you are.

Yeah.

And then explain what that looks like for them in your life going forward. But I would say if you do that, make sure you know where the fuck they fit in and your life going forward. Because you can't be awesome. I don't know, after you just told this person that you don't have an interest in something that they're very interested in.

Ev'Yan Whitney

Yeah, your advice isn't far off. I mean, I am on the ace spectrum. And I have so many thoughts about this. So so many thoughts. And the one that I was going to suggest is having you and your partner read a book and you mentioned a documentary. I don't know of any documentaries, and people can let me know if there are documentaries about being on the spectrum, but read a book together about asexuality. Angela Chen's book Ace is an incredible read. I recommend it not even just to folks who are ace but I think it is an incredible book to read if you are a person who is sexual to understand how aceness is experienced how ace folks move through the world and to also sort of interrogate this compulsory sexuality that we're all in at all the time, like any given moment. And I will shout out that I have an episode on my podcast. I'm really bad at remembering the numbers of the episodes that I have. But I did an interview with Angela Chen about her book and about the ace experience. That could be another resource that you reach that you recommend or give to your partner to be like, “Hey, I was I stumbled across this podcast, you want to listen to it with me together.” That can be a really great thing too. I also love what you said Goody about like, make sure that you know how to like handle the situation as it comes up. Because I know that in my experience when talking about being ace, the first things that people do is they start overthinking like, “Well, what does that mean? Are we never gonna have sex again? Do you not love me anymore? Are you not attracted to me?” And maybe the answers to those questions are all Yes. Right. But I know that that can just create a panic in people's minds about like, okay, so you're coming out to me as this, that means that our entire relationship is going to change. But it's not that's not true.

Goody Howard

Right. And you have to have that, like you said, think about the questions that they're going to ask you, have answers for that. There is space for “I don't know”, but this cannot be an “I don't know” when it comes to “Okay, well, what does that look like for our relationship?”

Ev'Yan Whitney

Yeah, yeah.

Goody Howard

You gotta have a plan. If you know you're not gonna be able to be in relationship with this perso, because you are now walking in your truth of aceness whatever level that may be, that person needs to know that.

Ev'Yan Whitney

Absolutely, absolutely. And this isn't a way to sort of coddle them to be like, “So I'm ace but like, I'm willing to, like deny parts of my aceness so that I can be in a relationship with you.” I think it's important for you to really sit down and think to yourself, like, okay, “So if I'm ace, and I'm in a relationship with someone who is not ace, how would I like to navigate our relationship? Like, what feels good to me? What affirms my ace identity? And what, what sort of”—I don't want to say compromise, but what sort of—

Goody Howard

I mean, expectation—

Ev'Yan Whitney

Yes!

Goody Howard

I mean, expectations. But also make space for the fact that your partner may not be willing to work through or have these conversations, they may be like, alright, well, I wish you the best. You know, what I'm saying, regardless of what level you are, you know, what, where you are on the ace spectrum and how much your desire shows up. And they may not care about none of that. So be prepared for your partner to possibly opt out. Be prepared for the conversations that may look like opening the relationship up for other needs to get met. And how do you feel about that, where you sit in it, you know what I'm saying? Like, please, kind of you know how I'm one of those people that goes through the argument in my head before we have the argument.

Ev'Yan Whitney

I do the same.

Goody Howard

When you're going through the argument in your head, that is when you need to pull out all the big guns and have answers prepared for those guns, so that when you have the conversation, you're taking the lead.

Ev'Yan Whitney

And again, it's okay if you don't know what these things are going to look like. And if you feel that you are in a relationship with someone where you can sort of co-create a relationship dynamic that works for you, like you feel safe enough to say like, I don't really know what this means. But I want to be able to explore these options with you. Are you down? I think that that's an okay thing to do.

Goody Howard

Because there's still a level of certainty. I want to explore this with you.

Ev'Yan Whitney

Yes.

Goody Howard

As opposed to, I don't know what this looks like for us. But I'm over here.

Ev'Yan Whitney

Right. Right.

Goody Howard

You know?

Ev'Yan Whitney

Yeah. So I recommend, you know, sharing this conversation, or yeah, just reading books that talk about the ace experience. And also just taking time for yourself to really figure out okay, so I'm ace, what do I want this relationship to look like? And how can we both thrive in this relationship both get our needs met? And also, what are some ways that we might need to use our imaginations to figure out like, okay, so there is a standard way of having sex. But what are some different ways that we can explore and experiment with sexual intimacy and see if your partner is on board for that? I don't think that coming out as ace to a person who is not ace means the end of a relationship necessarily, especially if you both have, like I said, really good imaginations and you love each other. And you're able to know that like sex doesn't equal penetration and an orgasm, that there are many ways that sexual intimacy can look. So if you are in that space to explore that and you think your partner will support you in that. I say go for that. Okay, our last question. I'm so curious about what you're going to say about this, I get a lot of questions about sexual shame. And this question is, how can we get rid of shame connected with our sexual and also sensual desires? And I had another question actually, along those lines of like, I feel as though my sexual shame is keeping me from being the sensual person that I want to be and the sexual person that I want to be. So yeah, what does it look like to get rid of sexual shame?

Goody Howard

I think that— so when we use my working definition of sensuality, nonsexual pleasure experiencing nonsexual pleasure through all six of the senses, there is no shame there, the shame that exists in sexual sensuality, does not hold weight there. Because it's nonsexual pleasure. So the shame that exists with the sexual piece of it, or the sexual connotation of it does not exist. So I will say, to start there as redefining what sensuality means to you. And walking in that definition, I would also say when you think about the sexual shame that you experience, you're going to have to sit with it and think about where it came from. And you're going to have, you're going to have to unpack it, it's not going to be the easiest thing. But you're going to have to unpack it, and walk it back to whatever core values you are indoctrinated with that are being challenged. Understand that tradition is peer pressure from old dead white people. And sometimes, tradition can hold the test of time. And sometimes traditions no longer serve you. So if you dig into your shame, and you arrive at a tradition that no longer serves you find a new tradition or a new understanding or expand that tradition, in a way that fits into who you are becoming. Because what happens with shame. I say that shame and stigma are the parents of anxiety and depression.

Ev'Yan Whitney

Listen!!

Goody Howard

And shame is what happens when you outgrow the box society puts you in. So think about why you feel the way you feel when you experience that shame. And where that shame came from, where that training that's being violated that brought that shame along came from, and figuring out if it's something that's going to continue to serve you, or if it's something that you can get rid of and replace with something else, or if it's flexible enough to be expanded, but what is happening is you are outgrowing the box that society puts you in and you have to give yourself permission to bust out of that box.

Ev'Yan Whitney

Yes. I love that answer. I don't know if I have too much to add. Because I mean, that was kind of going to be my answer, which was like, define what the shame is, figure out where it comes from the source of the shame, get curious about your shame. I know a lot of us feel like shame shouldn't be examined or questioned or get curious about like we're supposed to run from it and hide from it and and resist it. But I always tell folks get curious about your shame. You know, ask ask your shame questions. Also explore how shame comes up in your body, you know, think about the ways and the shapes that shame takes in your own physical body. And again, this is not meant to do from a place of judgment or criticality, but more so just again, to be curious. And then also just reiterating what Goody said like, Okay, so now you know what the shame is, what do I want to feel instead? How do I want to see my sexual and sensual self instead? And what are the ways that I can begin to embody those new stories as a way to counteract these old stories that a lot of them were not even chosen? Like you didn't pick them? You didn't subscribe to them they were bestowed upon you. So yeah, I think everything that Goody said, I just wanted to add a little bit of sprinkles on top.

Goody Howard

You know, people a lot of people shame Big Mouth for some of the— you know, Big Mouth on Netflix is either hit or miss there is no in between, depending on the subject and how they tackle it. But I love the way they tackled shame. There was like a shame ghost like a shame, monster shame Phantom. And every time like when the master topic of masturbation came up, here comes the shame monster. He's like, making you feel bad about masturbation. Ah, and then the kids were like, why are you even here? Like, this is a natural thing. So they're talk to the shame like, are you serious, fam? I see you.

Ev'Yan Whitney

Yeah.

Goody Howard

You know, and then the shame monster had no power and he went away. And so I think addressing it head on instead of acting like it is not there. Or like, it doesn't bother you.

Ev'Yan Whitney

Yeah.

Goody Howard

or that it's not impactful, or that it doesn't show up in other parts of your life. You know?

Ev'Yan Whitney

Yeah, I mean, I think the only thing that I would add is just I just want to give some affirmation to this person because I know what it feels like to, to be in shame and to see everyone around you who seems so sexually confident and so sensually embodied and you're like, Well, my shame is preventing me from, from having those experiences, you are not alone. Lots and lots and lots of folks are experiencing shame around their sexuality to live in this world is to be shamed for something. And while I don't want to be a pessimist, I just, I did want to just say that like this notion of getting rid of shame is maybe a little strong. I don't, I don't want to, I don't want folks to feel as though like, I got to get rid of shame. And if I don't get rid of it, there's something that I'm not doing right. And so there's something inherently wrong with me or my process, because I still have shame. And I think that shame is very, it's a very, I don't want to say normal, but it but it sort of has been normalized, like to feel shame within your sexual self and your sensual self. So I don't know if it's possible to get rid of it. Because every day we wake up, we're going to be shamed for another thing. And another thing and another thing. My curiosity and my encouragement would be to sort of explore what it looks like for you to collaborate with your shame, to coexist with your shame, to not make it so much of a binary like, I'm either shame or I'm either in my shame, or I'm in my full confidence self, kind of going back to what we were talking about earlier about the impediments to sensuality, you know, like, it's not a black or white thing. Is it possible for you to access certain parts of your sensuality and your sexuality from a place of joy and confidence and pleasure and excitement, while also acknowledging that like, yeah, sometimes shame pops up. And that doesn't necessarily mean that like, I am further from this goal of, of sexual confidence. It's just part of the process.

Goody Howard

Because it's not linear.

That's right.

And I think about that, I think about shame, the way I think about grief. So people think that grief changes, right, they say you have three jars. And the grief is a little black ball, people think that the little black ball inside the jar gets smaller, what really happens is the ball stays the same, and the jar gets bigger. So the grief is the same grief, the shame is the same shame, but the jar got bigger, so it doesn't have the same weight.

Ev'Yan Whitney

Yes, I love that.

Goody Howard

So you may not necessarily liberate yourself from that shame. But that shame ain't gonna matter. It's not gonna hit the same.

Ev'Yan Whitney

I love that. I love that even just that visualization of this jar becoming bigger and bigger and bigger to not like house the shame, but to maybe hold it with a little bit of love and a little bit of compassion, and curiosity. Oh, my gosh, Goody, I could talk to you forever. But I know we both got things to do, especially you with your 17 different jobs that you that you do.

Goody Howard

And my son just texted me from school, "is someone picking me up?"

Ev'Yan Whitney

Well, let me let me not hold you any further. I just want to thank you so much for coming on and sharing your wisdom and your brilliance with us today. I would love to have you come back to talk more about sensuality and bodies and all kinds of stuff. So I hope you'll come back. But in the meantime, where can folks find you? Where can they support your work? How can they work with you in any capacity?

Goody Howard

Well, my name is Goody and everyone asks Goody, everything. So I'm @AskGoody on all social media platforms, Instagram is my current favorite. Website is AskGoody.com. If you want to, like work with me or anything like that, there's like buttons on the site, you can figure out how you want to work with you can hire me for a workshop, you can buy a replay one of my workshops, buy some sex toys, buy a t shirt, it's a great way to support a free way to support is to go to my Instagram page and share some stuff, save it, tag it, like it, comment it and share it. We cannot run ads as sexuality educators so share go so much further for us and impacts our business in such different ways. So that is definitely where people can catch me. Also, my email list is called the Goody Gang. And Instagram is always threatening to shut down my account. So please join the Goody Gang, so you get the emails. And just it comes with like, you know, tips and tricks and discounts and the world is opening up so I'm going to start traveling again. So the Goody Gang kind of informs where I travel. But those are the ways you can catch up with me. I appreciate you know being here. I'm definitely down to come back and thank you for having me.

. . .

Ev'Yan Whitney

I really loved that conversation. And I really love Goody. She's so fun and authentic and no nonsense. And that last piece is really refreshing in a world that is trying to keep us all nonsensical in some form. And I'm just so grateful that Goody took the time to speak with us today. I feel so full. And my hope is that you're walking away feeling full as well. Maybe a little bit more awake, maybe a little buzzy. I know I feel a little buzzy after that chat.

For this week's sensual practice, I want us to follow this thread that was explored in this conversation today about the impediments to our sensuality, you know, the things we do, the environments, we're in the stories we tell ourselves about ourselves, and even our own bad habits that keep us disconnected from our sensual selves. So often, we're trying to explore and engage in these concepts of softening ourselves and being more in our bodies and in our pleasure while doing so in the same spaces. And with the same mindsets that are exacerbating dissociation and disconnection.

A while ago, I was on a panel talking about pleasure and sensuality. And someone asked me what I thought the opposite of pleasure was. And I said that common knowledge would have us believing that the opposite of pleasure is pain. But that's not actually true. Because pain for some folks, for a lot of folks can be pleasurable. So no, the opposite of pleasure is not pain. To me, it's disconnection, it's being out of union with ourselves. It's creating a habit of or residing in trauma responses that have a staying contracted into ourselves, rather than being soft and open to our sensuality.

So in this moment, I want you to think about the things that keep you disconnected from yourself and the world around you. What habits do you engage in daily that take you out of your body? What habits do you engage in daily that take you out of your sensuality? I know for me, the first thing that pops into my mind is my phone. There is nothing that takes me out of my body faster than scrolling through Instagram, or through my newsfeed. Other things I personally do that keep me disconnected are rushing, like moving really fast for literally no reason. Multitasking, so doing more than one thing at a time and somehow expecting that my body and brain will be able to attend to them with full presence. Also, holding my breath is another big one that I do. And that holding strains my nervous system. It keeps me in a perpetual state of fight or flight. And I can literally feel that when that happens, I can literally feel the effects of that in my body. That is just a short list of the things that make me being in my body really challenging. And I want to turn it over to you and have you think about the things that you're doing consciously or unconsciously, that are hindering your ability to be in a space where you can be receptive to pleasure and sensuality.

And as you explore, please don't judge yourself too harshly. I mean, I think it's really important to remember that the things that we do are part of a larger problem in our culture, that values fast or slow, that tells us to disregard the needs of our body rather than tuning into them and listening. That tells us we are nothing if we're not constantly doing instead of actually being. So yeah, keep that in mind as you explore this prompts. You know, your habits are not something that you necessarily always subscribe to. And yeah, give yourself some grace about that.

And speaking of, this prompt is one of my favorites and it's also one of the many, many prompts that you will find in my book Sensual Self, which is a guided journal that helps you tap into your body and pleasure. And if you haven't gotten your copy, I recommend that you do so it's not just a beautiful book that you can read. And it is truly quite beautiful, if I may say so myself, it's a book that's meant to be used to help you embody your unique sensuality and get curious about all the pleasure you can experience with an in your body. Sensual Self, my book, is a great way to counteract this "go go go" culture we're living in. And it also helps you create a consistent practice of sensuality, and a container that I've created for you with exercises and questions to get you feeling and seeking. So check it out, and get your copy of Sensual Self wherever you find books.

Okay, the last thing I'll say about this particular prompt, is that once you sit down to really think about the self imposed, and also involuntary impediments that are getting in the way of you prioritizing your pleasure and being in your body, you can then look at that list of things and let it inform the ways you'd like to move differently in your world, which might look like setting up boundaries around certain things, or creating tiny rituals or practices that keep you connected throughout the day. One of my boundaries that I have for myself is that I don't keep my phone in my room at night, which is hard, but takes away my ability to stay up late, scrolling through my phone and absorbing stress and despair into my body. And since I know I'm a chronic breath holder, I try to incorporate mini breathwork sessions throughout my day to help me ground into my breath, which also helps me ground into my body. The adjustments that you might need to make to keep your sensuality at the forefront, don't need to be rigid or intensive, you know, like keep this process of exploring these boundaries, to keep your sensual self sacred, as simple as you can. Start small and start with what's doable for you. And check in every so often with these boundaries and these practices. And notice what might be shifting as you become more aware of these habits.

If it's helpful, you can also invite your friends and loved ones to either keep you accountable to these changes that you'd like to make, or have them do these changes with you, you know, set a new precedent where both of your phones are taken out of the bedroom or you're not going to watch TV first thing in the morning, you know little things like that it can be helpful to have folks who are on your team and championing your sensuality as well. And know that you're not alone in struggling with disconnect. To be human is to constantly vacillate between this struggle, and this sensuality. And it's frustrating that things can't be easier. But I for one, take heart in knowing that it's my responsibility to nourish my sensual self. Nobody else is going to do that for me. And so what might it be like to take the responsibility seriously, but also easefully. Just some food for thought for y'all.

And I'm going to leave it there. I wish you all so much ease and deep cleansing breaths as you explore this practice. And as you come back home to your sensual self this week.

. . .

Sensual Self is created and hosted by me, Ev’Yan Whitney. It is edited by myself and Tribble. Music is by Melodiesinfonie from his song called ‘Just Healing.’

For show notes, transcripts, and resources for your sensuality, go to evyanwhitney.com/podcast. You can also follow the show on Instagram @sensual.self.

As for me, I’m on Instagram at @evyan.whitney, and you can check out evyanwhitney.com to find out more about me and my work.

Also check out my book Sensual Self: Prompts and Practices For Getting in Touch With Your Body. You can find that wherever you find books.

Thanks so much for being here and I’ll see you in the next one.

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Episode 68: Who Is Wellness For? (with Fariha Róisín)

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Episode 66: How to Be a Sensual Man (with Maceo Paisley)