The Sexually Liberated Woman
Episode 38: Che Che is a Sexually Liberated Woman

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Hey, everyone! I’m Ev’Yan Whitney and this is The Sexually Liberated Woman.

Before we get into today’s conversation, I have a little announcement to make. After today’s episode, The Sexually Liberated Woman will be taking a break for the winter.

When November rolls around, that’s my cue to slow the fuck down, go a little inward, and give myself more space to just be. And it’s not just because it’s freaking cold outside and it’s getting pitch dark here now at 4:30. During this time, I try to be a lot more vigilant with my self-care and I start ramping down some of the projects I have on my plate—one of those being this podcast.

So to go with the flow of the season and to honor my own need and desire to take some space from this thing, I’m putting The Sexually Liberated Woman on pause for a few months.

And listen, I know that the last time I went on hiatus I was gone for like, an entire year, but I promise you, I will be coming back and I will be coming back super soon. And one of the reasons I’ll be able to come back soon is because of the incredible support I have from my Patreon community.

You guys have heard me talk all year about my Patreon, and I want you to know that this is no joke; your donations seriously help. Like, if it weren’t for the continued support from my patrons, the likelihood of me coming back to the podcast would be slim. Because it costs money to make this podcast, it takes a lot of time and a lot of work on my end. I know this is gonna sound dramatic, but seriously, if it weren’t for my patrons, The Sexually Liberated Woman wouldn’t be possible.

So I want to take this moment to give love and gratitude to every one of my active patrons: Alistair B, Alyssa RA, Aria M, Arianna C, Chantelle B, Elizabeth H, Erin H, Hannah W, Heather O, Jasmyn E, Jessie H, Jordan B (who is also my amazing transcriptionist, so thank you twice, girl), Kactus P, Kelly R, Lane B, Lead P, Lydia R and Lydia S, Madeline S, Marina M, Mike B, Monica, Samantha J, Sarah D, Savannah L, Tayler O, and Virginia C.

Thank you, from the bottom of my heart, for your help in keeping this podcast going strong this year. With your help this year, I was able to hire an editor and a transcriptionist to help me with the show. I was able to buy better equipment. I was also able to afford to host this podcast on a platform that helped me get on Spotify’s platform, which was major. So, you all have helped me and The Sexually Liberated Woman tremendously and it’s beyond words how grateful I am for you.

I also have some new patrons to shout out who joined this community within the last week, and they are: Emmanuelle T, Kala P, Rachel H, and Julia C. Thank you all for becoming brand new patrons of The Sexually Liberated Woman. You’re amazing.

And even though The Sexually Liberated Woman will be on hiatus for the winter, you can still become a patron! Just go to and chip in as little per month as a dollar to help support me as I create a new season. Well, actually, I don’t do seasons but you know what I mean.

In exchange for your monetary support, during the hiatus I’ll be sending you exclusive updates and sneak previews of the upcoming season, and other fun things to stay in touch with you guys. I actually just shared my first video greeting a few days ago, which was a little embarrassing because I looked so tired, but hey, when you join my Patreon you get the realness.

So if you want to keep in touch and know the moment The Sexually Liberated Woman is out of hibernation, go to and become one of my beloved patrons.

And thank you.

. . .

OK, let’s get into today’s conversation—which I’m really stoked to share with you. It’s a chat I had with Che Che Luna about her sexual liberation journey and how she became sexually free.

In my work as a sexuality doula and sex educator, I’ve had the privilege of working with some incredible women and femmes who are ready to change and dramatically heal their sexualities. They come to me because they’ve spent years feeling sexually inhibited, years feeling shame and dogma and trauma, and they’re tired of it.

They’re tired of being disconnected from their bodies, they’re tired of the old stories and insecurities blocking their sexual expression. They want to feel more free. They want more pleasure, more intimacy, more sensuality, more confidence, more joy in their sexual lives and they’re ready to do whatever it takes to finally step into that.

And my work with Che Che was no exception.

Che Che came to me a bit further along in her sexual liberation journey than most of the people I work with. She had a deep connection with her body, she had a sensuality practice, she had reconciled with much of the shame that had weighed down her sexuality in the past. But there was still something missing for her—she wanted more intimacy with her wife, she wanted to challenge some of the negative stories around her arousal and orgasm, she wanted to find her erotic voice.

So, shortly after she reached out to me we got to work and I have to say, her journey into deep and lasting sexual healing was incredible. Like, so, so inspiring. I watched Che Che blossom into a sensual, powerful woman. I watched her claim and prioritize her pleasure. I watched her transform the sexual relationship she had with her wife—I mean, all of this was so beautiful.

But one of the best parts about our work together was that through that work, Che Che became a sex and sensuality coach of her own, and she was able to really step into her power as a sexual healer and advocate for other women—which, I’d like to add, is not uncommon. Actually a lot of the people I’ve worked with have enjoyed and been touched by the experience so much that they go on to become educators and healers themselves.

All of this to say—I feel really lucky to have witnessed Che Che blossom and to now consider her a friend and a peer in this brave work.

So in this conversation, me and Che Che talk about how she found voice her voice during sex, the ways she used her solo sexual relationship to deepen the intimacy and pleasure she experiences with her wife, and all of the amazing things she liberated in herself after releasing some super old limiting beliefs that were bestowed upon her by the patriarchy.

This conversation was such a pleasure as was my time spent working with her. And I’m excited to introduce you to Che Che and her story.

Oh, and if you wanna learn more about Che Che and her work, you can find her at

OK, here’s our conversation.


Ev'Yan: Hey Che Che, how's it goin’?

Che Che: Hey so good. How are you?

Ev'Yan: I'm good. I'm really good and I'm looking so forward to walking down memory lane about your progress and just your process of sensual and sexual liberation.

Che Che: Me too. I'm so excited to be here with you. Thank you for having me.

Ev'Yan: Yeah of course. I mean one of the reasons why I wanted to talk to you and like highlight you is because I loved the work that we did together. I loved how beautifully you always showed up in session and the transformations that you went through as a result of us working together. I don't know I just- I, I'm so inspired by it. I resonate with it so deeply and so it's literally an honor and a pleasure to have you as part of this conversation.

Che Che: Thank you so much. That reflection means a lot. And I totally agree. It was like it was literally life-changing to do the work that we did together and like so revolutionary in my life. So yes. Yes to all of that.

Ev'Yan: I kind of want to start from the very beginning to when we first started working together. Actually do you know when that was? I mean it feels like it was forever ago but I know that it wasn't. I know that it was like, it was like- yeah when was it?

Che Che: I almost feel like, no. It couldn't have been a year ago.

Ev'Yan: No. See that's what I'm saying. Like it feels- it doesn't feel like it was that long ago. Oh my god, maybe it was a year ago.

Che Che: I think I did reach out last summer and then we like had a gap before we actually started.

Ev'Yan: Wow. Oh my God. Yeah. It was a year ago.

Che Che: Woah that's amazing.

Ev'Yan: That's pretty crazy. Like for whatever reason I was thinking that like, oh we started working together in January. But that was not the case. Wow.

Che Che: It really shows me like how much- like it still feels so fresh. Like within my being like all the work that we did do. Like I remember it just so vividly and so clearly.

Ev'Yan: That's, that's so wild to think about because it literally feels like I don't want to say yesterday but it certainly feels a lot more recent that we were doing this work together.

Che Che: It totally does.

Ev'Yan: So I don't know, I mean you know as we're like kind of geeking over the fact that it was a long, a longer time ago than we expected, I don't know if it's possible for you to think about who you were when you did reach out to me last summer. But I'm curious to know about that. Like where were you at and what was it that made you reach out? To wanting to finally do this work.

Che Che: I feel like there was a whisper that started to like speak within me that was like, there is more for you to tap into. Like there's just- there was something that was like calling me that I didn't quite, I wasn't able to articulate it for a long time. And but I was following you and I was following your journey and for like a while I was so inspired by the work you were doing and yet I didn't even feel like it was a possibility to work with you for a long time. It was as if I would like, like it's a perfect mirror of like where my self-worth was at that time. Where I was like, Oh that that works for other people that are more ready or more worthy or whatever it was. I didn't even like see it as a potential for me.

Che Che: And then as this like whisper started to get louder, I realized that it was linked to me feeling like I was fragmented. Like I feel like I was moving about my life very much so disconnected from my power, from my body, from my sexuality, from my sensuality. And as that voice kept coming back and kept getting louder and louder it showed me that like, that voice was trying to send me a message. That voice was trying to be like, you are worthy of this work. Like even if you're really afraid of it, what if you leaned into it? What if you stepped into it? Like what if you said yes to work with you, which at that time was terrifying for me. Like it was a really big jump. But it literally ended up being like one of the most powerful yeses and like investments to myself that I've ever made.

Che Che: At that point in my life felt like I wasn't able- I felt like a blockage around my voice. I felt a blockage around being able to advocate for myself. I felt very intense people pleasing tendencies happening daily. I felt like my cup was empty and I was like moving from a place of depletion and frustration instead of overflow and I feel also like I intellectually knew that my sexuality was beautiful and I knew that it was sacred but I wasn't embodying it. I wasn't living in alignment with that.

Ev'Yan: I really relate to that in so many ways because I also have had that kind of intellectual knowledge that my sexuality is beautiful and my body is nothing to be ashamed of. And you know all these, all these other things and- but for whatever reason I wasn't actually living and expressing that in like a real conscious and like open brazen kind of way. And that's actually one of the reasons why I started using, or started taking sensual selfies. Because that was like my one way to really be able to explore and even like reflect the sexual empowerment and the sexual positivity that I didn't really feel I was tapping into.

So I just, I love that you put words to something that like I constantly come back to in terms of like my own origin story about the work that I do. Like why it was, I started to get more deep into being more open and like- also this notion of finding your voice. I mean again that's something that so resonates with me and maybe that's why like the work that you did and the work that I witnessed you do was so powerful for me and so inspiring for me because I saw so much of myself in what you were working through and what you were uncovering and just like giving yourself permission to be.

Che Che: Ugh that's beautiful. And I feel that. It's like when I finally gave myself permission to say yes to working with you and to commit to the work, you became like this amazing mirror for me. Just like a direct reflection of like my capacity of what I already had within me but was not allowing myself to unlock. And so to hear it from your side, right, saying that back to me is really inspiring and just really beautiful that it goes both ways.

Ev'Yan: What I liked so much about our work together was that like you, you aren't like my typical client. Like usually I get people who have no idea what sexual empowerment looks like for them. What it looks like to embody sex positivity. They don't really have a connection with their bodies or their sensuality. But with you, what I found so interesting about you reaching out to me was that like you were so much further along than most of the people that I tend to work with. Like you're a dancer, you have a really keen sense of body awareness and even like body love that most of the clients that I've worked with didn't really have access to yet. And so I always thought it was, I remember when I got your application and as I was like, you know, reading through what you wrote and then even the first call that we had together before we had our first session I was like, does she really need this?

Ev’Yan: Like she's so much further along and in certain realms like I'm just thinking about like the way that you're so connected to your body and the sense of body awareness you had. And so I'm wondering like, I don't even know if there's a question in there, but I just wanted to acknowledge that like to me it was so fascinating that like even with the body awareness that you had, and even with this connection to your sensuality and like not just an intellectual knowledge but like an emotional and spiritual connection to your sexuality that you had, there was still something missing. And I feel like you alluded to that a little bit talking about, you know, not really being able to use your voice. But I also, I don't know, again I don't know if there's a question in there but it just- it just, it was very striking for me that like, yeah despite where you were at, there was still more work to be done for you.

Che Che: Yes. And I feel like that speaks to this journey right, of like, this like really nonlinear healing that we're all in where it never ends and there's always expansion and there's always room. Like that's really really cool that you had that perspective of where I was and what's so fascinating is that where I felt like I was, was very much lacking. Very much like, I have so much more to embody. And there's so much more to tap into. I have so much more pleasure to experience that I haven't even felt yet. And like there's all these areas of my life where I felt like I was holding back and where I- there was a lot of limited beliefs that I, through our work, like I didn't even realize that I was carrying them. And then to identify them and bring light to them and bring awareness to them I could totally rewrite them and that was like huge for me.

Ev'Yan: Do you remember any of those limiting beliefs that you had?

Che Che: I do. There were a lot of beliefs surrounding what my sex should look like. What it should feel like. Like I had this like very fairy tale like plot in my head that was like really deep in there, and really blocking me from being present and experiencing pleasure in my body when being intimate with myself or with others. And so it was like, I need to orgasm every time I have sex. I need to orgasm with my partner when she's orgasming. Like there was a lot of pressure to perform. There was a lot of goal oriented sex where we were just like, it was so focused on like reaching this peak orgasm.

There was like insecurities in what I looked like during sex and what I should sound like. And those were all things that I was holding on to because I hadn't yet created this space in my life to challenge them. I hadn't yet like questioned them. And so in our work together you were able to open up this space and guide me in reminding me of all these truths and reminding me that those really unrealistic standards that our culture and that patriarchy like ingrained in me are not true. I was able to really reclaim and rewrite those beliefs for myself.

Ev'Yan: Yeah I remember being struck by the conversations that we were having around dismantling a lot of these limiting belief systems about sex, sexuality. And it was so interesting how like you are in queer partnership with your wife. You guys are married now. That was like another amazing thing that happened during the time that we were working together was that you guys got married. And I remember being like, wow it's so crazy that like these are things that are still- that are coming up for you. Particularly because you're in a queer relationship, you know? And it just speaks to how this patriarchal male gazey, masculine dominated sexual expression no matter what our sexual orientation is, no matter who we're, you know, sharing or bed with, no matter what our gender is, like it's so fucking pervasive.

Che Che: It is and that, that's so true. Like I- like our culture teaches us, right, to be like, oh there's something wrong with me. There's something wrong with my body. There's something broken. It's not that the systems are fucked up, right?

Ev'Yan: Yes.

Che Che: It's not me. It's the systems. And so like that was revolutionary to like be able to give that gift to myself to be like woah, I am whole. And I can create a context daily that does serve me. And my body isn't against me. And I can trust it. And I can trust my voice. And all these things that I was taught to not trust.

Ev'Yan: Yeah. Ugh I love what you said about like, we're not broken the system is broken. Like that's so true, you know? Like there's nothing wrong with our bodies, there's nothing wrong with our sexualities, it's just the system itself is broken. And like what a radical thought to not look at ourselves as inherently and fundamentally flawed, but like to put the responsibility on systems of oppression that have made it their business to keep us small and to keep us insecure, you know?

Che Che: Yes. Like that- I would argue that as a queer woman of color, like to be able to reclaim the truth that I am not broken is like, it feels like the single most empowering thing I can do in this life. Like to be like, Oh like I do have, I do have power within me. And that power is worthy of love. Of being seen. Of being heard, right? Of acceptance.

Ev'Yan: Yeah. Yeah. It's an act of resistance. It literally is an act of resistance to be who you are as a queer woman of color and then also changing these narratives about sex and sexuality. I remember your relationship was definitely one of the areas that felt like it needed some liberation from you. Particularly in how you were accessing sex. You don't have to go into any detail, like you know say however much you want to, but I do know that this was like a really big portion of the work that we did. And I'd be curious to hear like more about that from you.

Che Che: During our work I had this beautiful foundation with my wife. Like this beautiful spiritual connection, physical connection, trust. Like we had gone through so many like deep journeys together up until that point. And so I feel that this calling within me to like awaken, to like step even deeper into my voice and my sexuality and like self advocacy, was directly going to affect that relationship, right? And like it made me realize that the sex we were having was like we were- it was very much like we were just moving through the motions. Like we were just doing what had worked maybe a year ago, two years ago, and it was- it didn't have the presence and like the pleasure potential that I knew it could. But it also always came back to me and it always came back to, why am I having such a hard time stating what I want? And stating what I need? And using my voice during sex? And that led me to being like, woah okay I- it's because I don't actually know. Like I didn't actually know like what I, how I wanted to articulate what I wanted.

Che Che: What were the words that I wanted to use? What were the things that I didn't like? Where were my boundaries? Those are all things that I let just go. Like I, up until that moment in my life, I hadn't stood up for myself in being like, these are things that feel good. And these are things that don't. Or these are things that make me feel uncomfortable. Or these are things- like whatever it was. So that lead me to like having, to diving into a really like consensual, beautiful relationship with myself in like making more time to self pleasure and making time to explore what does my body like and what does feel good. And then I could take that back into our sex and our relationship and get more playful and be able to realize that, wow okay if we- if I can verbalize that I'd like to move slower, and that I don't want to have a time restraint on sex. How much that helped me like amplify my pleasure.

Che Che: I realized that it was hard for me to receive pleasure. To receive- like if all the focus was on me. And I was like, what is that? Why? What, what's happening in that space? Why am I so in my head? And I realized because there was this overall like, whatever actions we were doing or whatever I was receiving was strictly to like get me to climax. Not just to like explore my sensations in my body and to try like new pathways and new things and new positions and have it really be like this really sacred like moment instead of just like autopilot almost.

Ev'Yan: Right. Yeah, I I love- I love that you're speaking about this. It's one of my favorite things to facilitate, to guide people through, that I work with, this like connection to themselves. Like this commitment, I guess, to your sexual relationship. Not with your partner, but with yourself. And I think, I definitely had some experience telling my clients in the past to, rather than focus so much about what's going on in their sexual relationship with their partner, to instead focus and put attention and intention on the solo sexual relationship that they have with themselves. Not as a way to take away from the sexual relationship that they have with their partner, but as a way to add to it.

And so, the way that you were able to use your solo sexual relationship as a method to exploring yourself, being more clear about what turns you on, exploring what pleasure looks like for you, and also even just like working through some of the limiting beliefs that you had about sex in itself, like sex with your partner as a whole, solo sexual relationships are so powerful.

Ev'Yan: You know I think so often in our culture, and I've heard this many times too, that like you know if you masturbate too much it's taking away from your you know committed sexual partnership that you have. And I think it's actually the opposite. I think that solo sexual relationships can be an amazing, an amazing way for you to connect with your partners in a sexual way. On a more deeper, more intimate level. And it's so funny how it works out because it definitely sounds counterintuitive but just based on my experience both personally and like professionally, it works. You know?

Che Che: It totally works. I feel like I'm like living proof of that too.

Ev'Yan: Yeah. Yeah. And it was so beautiful to watch you come home to yourself through your solo sexual relationship and also achieve and experiment with new levels of sensuality and intimacy in your partnered sexual relationship.

Che Che: Yeah. There is also this like shattering of something that I didn't even realize how much it was like holding me back, but this belief that my person needs to meet all my needs. Which is like, in my opinion, is totally unrealistic.

Ev'Yan: Yeah.

Che Che: So when I was able to shine light on that and like realized that I was holding that weight, it was so liberating. It was so liberating to have like a beautiful conversation with her where we both got to like come into this consensual space and get on the same page about like, let's talk about how we've been taught this fairy tale, right? And that one person needs to be our emotional support and needs to cover all of our sexual desires and the list goes on and on and on right. So that kind of was what opened my heart up to- opened it up to like this possibility of opening our relationship. Because that feels like- that belief that like one person can't meet all my needs, like fed this exploration of well, I believe I am here to connect with other people, to be seen, to be touched, to be- to experience this life through different relationships.

Che Che: And that was something that I definitely was timid about. I was afraid of the unknown. I was afraid of like what, what does that mean? Like do I have the capacity to love more than one person at once? Or like can I move through those bigger emotions when things aren't black and white? But then I come back to like, but what if I don't? What if I, what if I don't allow myself to fully blossom and to fully like live in that state of liberation? And I feel like I'd be doing a disservice to myself and my life.

Ev'Yan: Yeah. I love that you mentioned the non-monogomy piece or just like even just thinking about alternative forms of being in relationship with people. It often comes up in my work a lot. Not necessarily like people who work with me end up being like polyamorous. That's like not what happens. But like I think that there's something very powerful about even just having these discussions. Without any like set goal of like, okay after we've had this discussion we're now gonna be dating other people. Like there's something very very healing, very illuminating, about having conversations about that. About the fact that like, I love you. You are my partner. And I have to recognize the fact that you cannot meet every single need of mine.

Ev'Yan: That's just not physically, humanly possible. And it's also not fair. You know? I mean that's a lot of pressure and a lot of weight to put on your partner. So just being able to have awareness about that. Having conversations about that without it having to go toward like, okay we're putting up an OK Cupid profile. I mean there's something very powerful in just starting that conversation because suddenly you're beginning to form new stories, new traditions, new value systems around what romance, partnership, commitment, sexuality, love looks like, you know?

Ev'Yan: And just like how we were saying earlier that, you know, you're not broken the system is broken. I mean I would also argue that like relationships aren't broken. It's the system that we have created about what love looks like, about what partnership looks like, about what fidelity looks like, is broken. And so when we begin to like analyze those things and like really interrogate and unpack those things, suddenly we have more possibilities. Like suddenly we're like, oh we don't have to like live by this script that we watched our parents do and our grandparents do. Like we get to choose. We get to have the kind of relationship that we want to have. And that relationship can still look monogamous, but you come to that relationship with new intention and new like awareness. Like you both are signing up with consciousness for the particular relationship that you are both continuing to create.

Che Che: Yeah. I have the biggest smile on my face I'm like yes.

Ev'Yan: (Laughing) Yeah. Yeah. And I mean I say all of that because like, I know it's really easy for people to be like, non-monogamy is the most, you know, enlightened way to be in relationship with folks and I don't necessarily believe that to be true. I mean I think everyone is different. Everyone, every relationship is different. But I do think that having conversations where you both as a couple, whether you're in a monogamous relationship or in a non monogamous relationship, pick apart your ideas of what commitment is based on what our culture has taught us.

Ev'Yan: Like there's just something very empowering about being able to say like, nope I'm going to choose how I want to be in relationship. I'm going to choose how I want to respond if my partner says that she finds someone else cute. Like that doesn't necessarily have to mean that they're going to abandon me. That doesn't necessarily have to mean that they don't find me sexually attractive. I don't know. I'm saying all of this because I've also had so many beautiful conversations with my partners about these very things and just putting more mindfulness and more awareness to these things has created not just like a beautiful space for us to be in relationship but it also just takes a lot of pressure off of both of us, you know?

Che Che: Yes. It's such a like, ugh, like breath. It's such an exhale, right?

Ev'Yan: Yeah yeah.

Che Che: And yeah I completely agree with everything that you just shared. And I'm really starting to learn like as my wife and I continue to like open up our relationship, I'm learning that the epitome of love to me is liberation. And so like when I am loving someone it means that my heart is completely open to them, yet I'm not holding on. I'm not gripping. I'm not like in this state of like protectiveness. That I am able to simultaneously love and let go at the same time. And like that has been one of the most beautiful experiences that I've had recently, where I just feel like my heart's like cracked open. And I feel like this is something so beautifully vulnerable that I feel proud to be moving through right now. I feel like it's very ego less. And it's very spiritual. And it's- it reminds me that love is so much more vast than, yeah, the ideas that we've been taught that it is.

Ev'Yan: Yeah. Yeah. Because like in our culture, love is possession. You know? Love is overprotected. Love is like, I don't know. Love isn't jealousy, but it's that feeling behind jealousy. Like I mean I've- I know that you've probably heard this amongst your friends like, oh yeah my boo when they're jealous like it makes me feel good because I know that he really really loves me or that he really likes me. Like if we strip all of those things away and be like, okay what exactly is love? If it wasn't these problematic and like not very true ideas of what love is in terms of like, it's possession, it's over protectiveness, it's like pain and like you know heartbreak, like what is it? And suddenly like, yeah it becomes this really beautiful thing. And that's not to say that like love in those relationships don't incorporate those things. I mean we're all human and we're still operating within these systems that have been around forever that have told us that love is jealousy and protectiveness and you know all of those things. But I mean it definitely gives us a better way to create new foundations that we want our relationship to stand on, you know?

Che Che: Yeah exactly.

. . .

Ev'Yan: One of my favorite things that I witnessed when you and I were working together was how through this work, you started to come more in to your position, your role, as a healer as well. As an empowerer of other women, other femme folks. And so I wondered if you could talk a little bit about like that process for you. Because I remember when we first started, I know that you kind of had an inkling that you were wanting to do this work but I feel like at the end, like our very last session, it was like solidified. Like you knew not just like what you wanted to do but precisely who you wanted to help and how. And I'm curious about like how that work helped shape the work that you're now doing for other women and other femmes.

Che Che: Yeah. This work that we did together like we said earlier it was like such divine timing. It was like all of these threads started coming together in my life. And I feel that you held this space that allowed the healer within me, and allowed this really deep innate desire to hold space for other people, to really blossom. Like it fully- like you said like it came into fruition during our work. And it came because I finally let myself. I gave myself permission and I said to myself, I'm made for this. Like this is why I'm here. And up until that point, my soul knew that but I was so afraid of not being ready or of not being enough or feeling like I needed to get all of these credentials and all of these things before I could hold space. And what I realized is like if I were to wait until I was completely healed to be a healer, like I would never start, right?

Ev'Yan: Right.

Che Che: And like it- like that reality that like, oh we are all collectively and continuously moving through healing. That it's never done, there's no destination. That this is like, this is about how can I authentically and genuinely open my heart and hold space for people that are meant to come into my field and are meant to like- just like I did within you, I saw myself in you. And I knew that you could be like this influencer for me. I knew that you could be this reminder of all of the wisdom that I already had within me. And that's exactly what I, what I am doing now for my clients. But I am very much like, I don't believe in hierarchy and I don't believe that anyone else has answers that other people don't. And I feel that it's so important within this work to be okay with not always having the answers. And be honest about where am I in my own journey and then to allow that to show other people that they're not alone. To show other people that everything that they're moving through is okay and like it's on purpose, you know?

Ev'Yan: Yeah I love that. I so love that. And I'm so glad that you are doing this work. I mean your work is such a testament to the reason why I do this work because it's not just to help heal the person that I'm in session with. I have this awareness and this understanding that when I am in session with someone I'm not just healing them, I'm healing their entire female lineage that came before them. And then I'm also helping to heal all the people that are in their, you know, in their immediate universe. You know? Their lovers, their friends, their family members, their community.

Ev'Yan: There's something incredibly powerful about healing yourself because it helps others to find healing within themselves. And so that's one of my favorite I guess outcomes of the work that we did together, is seeing you heal yourself, seeing you come to new understandings and live new stories within yourself. And then also you're going to do it for other people! Like you are literally doing it for other people in the same way that, you know, we worked together you are also being a conduit of healing. A conduit of empowerment and exploration and liberation for others. And I'm like anytime that I hear someone else is doing this kind of work like within sort of the realm of the work that I'm doing, I'm like ugh yes. We need more. We need more people like you doing this work because it's definitely a collective effort, you know?

Che Che: Yes. Thank you. And I feel that so deeply. I feel like this awakening and this rising, and I feel that like we really do need more. We really do need more of it. And I was so appreciative and grateful of just like your grace, and your like giving, and your openness. And like there's so much of our culture that teaches us that we have to keep our resources secret and we have to like-.

Ev'Yan: Yes.

Che Che: Be in competition with people in the same line of work. And like it was just so like inspiring and so profound that you held this space to be like, yes step in. Yes like please like join me in this work. Yes like here's resources. Yes, yes you can do it. Right? Like there was so much encouragement and so much love that you shared with me to be able to have the courage to step in. And I'm like eternally grateful for that because I feel like we all really- we can't do this work alone, right? We can't. We need that- we need the guides. We need the support. We need that love and we need like that new lens of like, you saw me so in my power before I fully even stepped into it. And like that is the greatest gift that I could ask for in a guide and like healer.

Ev'Yan: Amazing. Yeah. And thank you so much for sharing your journey and for showing up so bravely and so boldly in every session that we had. I mean the work that we did together was so inspiring to me on a personal level. And I'm just so grateful and like feel very like blessed that I was able to cross paths with you and witness your growth and your transformation and I'm so happy to have you as like a sister in doing this work. You know? Like it's really rad to have watched you transform and also it's incredibly rad to watch you help transform other people. So thank you.

Che Che: I just got chills. Thank you.

Ev'Yan: I know this whole conversation has been giving me all kinds of chills and like, I don't know. There's definitely spirit. Every time I talk to you I feel like spirit shows up and is like definitely making sure that we know that it's here. So yeah. I love chatting with you. It's so great.

Che Che: Thank you. Thank you so much. It's been such a gift and you have been an immeasurable gift in my life and such a soul mate. So I'm just like endlessly, endlessly grateful for the work you're doing, for the ways in which you're showing up for yourself and for your clients. And it's absolutely incredible.

Ev'Yan: Thank you. Thank you so much.

. . .

Hey, before I let you go. If you’re feeling all kinds of inspired after listening to Che Che’s sexual awakening and you’re craving to experience a similar kind of healing and transformation with your sexuality, let’s begin, together. My books are now open for new clients starting in 2019 and I would love to make some magic with you.

If you’re ready to invest in yourself and finally make a lasting transformation in your sexual life, go to and put in an application to work with me. Again, that’s to liberate and heal your sexuality in 2019, once and for all.

I’ll see you there.


The Sexually Liberated Woman is produced, edited and designed by me, Ev’Yan Whitney. With editing help by Justine McClellan and community support from each one of my very special patrons on Patreon.

If you love The Sexually Liberated Woman, I’d love it if you left me a review on Apple podcasts. And if you want to help sustain The Sexually Liberated Woman, go to and become a patron. I would love that too.

As for me, you can find me on my website where you can subscribe to my newsletter and learn more about my work as a sexuality doula. I’m also on Instagram @evyan.whitney

Have an amazing winter and I’ll see you really soon.

© 2020 Ev'Yan Whitney / All rights reserved.